I think I’m honestly speechless.
Apr 26th, 2008 by Rebecca
I’m no fan of Amanda Marcotte’s, and after her behaviour in response to concerns about her appropriation of brown voices, I would have said very little could surprise me in respect to digging herself deeper.
But this is unbelievable.
Each chapter in Marcotte’s new book, “It’s a Jungle Out There”, begins with a blatantly and obviously racist cartoon of a white woman fighting off scary black men attacking her with weapons. Marcotte has a long history of privileged, rotten behaviour towards people of colour (to put it lightly) but this is so explicitly racist that it should leave no one in any doubt. There is simply no excuse for this, either on Marcotte’s part, or that of her publisher, Seal Press, who have had their own jawdropping issues with women of colour of late. This book needs to be pulled from shelves, recalled, and if it must, reprinted. No one who could put out a book with these images should dare have the gall to call themselves feminist.
It’s a relief to see some of those who’ve been defending Amanda in recent weeks over her appropriation of brown voices, such as Jill Filipovic and Hugo Schwyzer, finally calling her out, albeit far too little too late in the case of the latter. It’s really important that the big bloggers, in particular, make it clear that this sort of racist nonsense has no place in the feminist blogsophere; while I’m not holding my breath, I would hope that Jessica Valenti in particular has the spine to join this particular chorus.
It’s time for white people to quit standing in solidarity with Marcotte because being called out for being a blatant racist might hurt her feelings. A number of people, such as Tobes, a blogger who I generally like, have continually suggested on the Feministe threads about this that people shouldn’t get angry at Marcotte, lest she get her back up and feel too stubborn to respond.
I can only imagine how upsetting it would be if my first book was met by such criticism- and by the people who I wanted to love it the most - fellow feminists.
It is a strange expression of privilege to, upon seeing criticism of someone who has screwed up - and in this case, screwed up beyond belief, turn it around onto the feelings of the person for having to put up with all that scary criticism. If you screw up, and you’re called out on that, you apologise, you learn from the experience, and you move on. You don’t get the excuse that your feelings are hurt just because you come from a background of - in this case white - privilege. As has been said numerous times in these threads, there is no opportunity for “safe space” for women of colour with regard to racism, and to insist upon it before a prominent feminist should deign to actually answer criticism that is justified in the strongest degree is a gross expression of privilege. It is ironic that it should be, as Tobes does, followed by “I wish we could all just get along” sentiment, because this sort of thing is only serving to drive more and more feminists - and there’s been a ton of bloggers doing this lately - to shun the feminist label.
Even for the likes of Marcotte and Seal Press, who I think had pretty much established her credentials as two of the most glaring examples of ignorant white privilege in the feminist community around, to actually engage in behaviour this jawdroppingly racist is just…I don’t get how someone can put out a book containing these images and still have the gall to turn around and call themselves a feminist. To that end, if you weren’t boycotting Seal Press after the first fiasco, now would probably be a good time to start (why, oh why, did Whipping Girl have to be released with them?). This is all so beyond disgraceful that I’m almost lost for words.
A few good links on this:
“I Guess It’s a Jungle in Here Too, Huh?” from Holly at Feministe.
“Stop! No, just stop!” from Galling Galla.
Lauredhel at Hoyden About Town.
Bastard Logic has contact details for Seal Press if people want to write letters.
Later addition:
Amanda Marcotte has now at least apologised, but it’s pretty unconvincing. For gods sake, she was called out a few months ago for having a cover that featured a white woman being assaulted by a big dark ape, and yet she somehow forgot to notice that the book was littered with imagery as bad. Perhaps if Marcotte had spent a little bit less time convincing herself that the initial criticism was because people were trying to be mean to her, and a little more time doing some self-examination, she wouldn’t be in this mess. Again. Being “excited about your first book” does not give you carte blanche to be a racist asshole of the highest order.
Seal Press also has a far less convincing apology out. It’s not even a real apology - it’s an “I’m Sorry You Were Offended” apology. It seems as if they STILL HAVEN’T LEARNED from the whole fiasco with Blackamazon. Why in the hell should a supposedly feminist press have to put themselves through anti-racist training to avoid putting out a book with imagery so racist that practically every single other person in the entire feminist blogosphere could see it in an instant? They’re a disgrace, and as I said above, if you weren’t boycotting their books already, now would be a good time to start.
Even later addition:
Jill Filipovic has responded, and it’s one of the single best responses I’ve seen from another white feminist in this entire sorry mess. There’s a reason why Jill is a cut above most of the white feminist Big Bloggers out there. Considering that we’ve just lost another brilliant voice from the blogosphere in part as a result, though, I just wish people could stop fucking up to begin with. It’s all well and good to apologise, especially if, as Jill does, it shows that you actually get it, but sometimes the damage is already done.
Hey Rebecca,
I think I owe an apology here — and everywhere– let it be known that my “lightbulb” moments are still catching up with me and I do apologize for the lag!
From me, posted on feministe thread:
Okay– I just realized something HUGE— I’m tooting the ‘forgiveness horn’ and talking about “building a foundation” wayyyyy too soon.
I just scrolled up and looked at those pictures again.
Maybe we need to be pissed for awhile. It’s too soon to move on. And we CAN’T MOVE ON without apologies and discussion from Seal and Amanda.
I get that now. I’ll try not to deny the legitimate hurt anymore. Those images are inexcusable and it’s asking too much to talk about safe spaces just yet when so many people are shown time and again that they shouldn’t expect to feel safe within their own feminist community.
I see that now.
I’m sorry.
Also here– http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/04/25/i-guess-its-a-jungle-in-here-too-huh/#comment-167585
Your blog is wonderful– thanks for saying you like me (when I don’t have my head up my own butt).
Keep fighting the good fight.
Holy crap. Marauding natives? Really?
Thank you, Tobes. Ironically, you’ve demonstrated exactly what someone should do when they’ve been called out for screwing up. There are other people who really could do to follow that lead right about now.
Robbie: Yes. The first link in the post contains the scanned images. Be prepared to projectile vomit.
I Write Letters (and You Can, Too!)…
Dear Seal Press,
There’s nothing “groundbreaking” (nor *cough* “subversive” or “ironic”) about undeniably racist imagery. What the bloody blue hell were you thinking?
Warmest regards,
matttbastard
P.S. You mig…
Thanks Rebecca.
I’m still learning…. LOTS… thanks for understanding.
PS: to Robbie, she’s not even joking– the images are vomit-worthy.
Exactly.
I (white woman) didn’t “see” it myself until someone said, “Oh, nice. Jungle native stuff.” So it’s pretty humbling, to have one’s privilege-blindness pointed out. I’m not bothered in the least by Tiffany’s quote from her relative about being careful around white folks–it looks like she’s pretty damned right, doesn’t it?
I’m sorry about that.
Also, the stuff about safe spaces–Amanda has a blog of her own. She gets hate mail all the time and seems to deal with it just fine. Surely she could say something. The fact that she doesn’t makes it look like she WON’T. Any reasons why not (legal, “career”, etc.) look like the same old crap to me. We’re all in it together until someone gets a leg up in the “legitimate” system, then any criticism is characterized as mere envy.
Well, yeah. Amanda’s had plenty of opportunities to address any of the issues that have come up so far, but she’s chosen to dig herself deeper every time. When it was the book cover, she said “I knew you people would find something to complain about”, when it was her appropriating other feminists’ work, she said “you’re just jealous and trying to destroy me”; god knows what she’ll come up with this time. I suppose there’s always hope for an apology, but I’m expecting some new level of narcissistic excuse.
[…] just leave it to the many responses by WoC to this controversy; here and here would be a good start-up for […]
I was so looking forward to Amanda’s book - I’m a fan of her writing style, the way she distils ideas down and wraps them with a sarcastic little bow. I wanted to be able to promote it as a cool little feminist book. I hoped that after the outrage over the original cover art that she would have got it.
But as long as it contains these images I can’t stand to even read it.
Tobes: yeah, appreciated.
I mean, the thing is, at a certain point, if someone’s determined to dig a hole for herself, even if one feels sympathetic, one climbs out of the hole before one gets buried oneself, and just tries to stop her from whacking everyone else with the shovel.
uh, i think i just killed that metaphor.
oh, she did apologize now. it’s up at Pandagon. but, she also says she, like, didn’t notice. which, okay, you’re already on the -book tour- and you just…didn’t really check. ‘k.
and Seal Press is all like, they’ll withdraw, reprint without the illustrations, “we’re sorry, we weren’t thinking” (!) and are “going to an anti-racist training.”
I am a mean bastard: I think they should go to the training? but I also think they should be shitcanned. I mean, it’s this, AND it’s the crap with BA and Adele, and you know what, no, it’s not even a question of “we are trying to Learn,” this shit should be 101 for god’s sake, and then with the negative PR skills in general…no, completely fucking incompetent.
as for Amanda: -just so fucking tired of her-
Marcotte does deserve a bit of credit, I suppose, for at least issuing a proper apology. But perhaps if she’d been a little less of a narcisstic asshole and engaged in the teensiest bit of self-reflection after being called out on the cover, she might have thought “oh, gee, my book is filled with similar images! I might want to fix that!” Being excited about your first book does not give you carte blanche to be a racist asshole.
Seal Press, on the other hand, just…my god. Anti-racist training? They’re supposed to be a feminist press. Coming off the back of the whole mess with their treatment of BA and Adele, how in the bejesus could they not see what everyone else could in an instant? They really do deserve that boycott; and moreover, the two editors, yeah, really do deserve to be shitcanned.
I for one am really REALLY (REALLY) happy that Amanda came out with a “yep I screwed up and I’m sorry” apology. I was afraid, after hearing her call it a “dust up,” that she’d shirk responsibility but I DID get the sense that there was remorse and since I believe she’s done great work and can do it again I will get the offensive-image free book when it comes out.
Belledame– the shovel metaphor — awesome.
I still don’t excuse the comment from Tiffany. I think it’s unacceptable to write off a group of people based on skin color because of a bad experience with some of them. That’s just me. Her writing off “white chicks” and saying “they need to get over themselves” simply shows ignorance. I don’t deny anyone the right to be pissed at the injustices of the world but I draw the line there.
I think Tiffany was right on - and I’m a white woman. We’re in the privileged group here, and white feminists as a whole haven’t exactly been on a winning streak with regard to WoC issues anytime recently. It isn’t necessarily about you; if you’re not one of the racist many, then don’t identify with them.
Rebecca, I think that’s big of you, I hope you know that. However while I don’t identify with racist people, I do identify as a white woman. I can’t deny my skin color or my heritage. I’m white. My family is white. My ancestors were white, and I’m proud of where I came from. Not at the expense of anyone else mind you, but damn if I’ll let anyone make me feel ashamed of myself because I’m white.
Would it ever be acceptable for me to say, “You women of color need to get over yourself”?
UMM DEAR GOD NO. It’s disgusting just to type it. And I don’t think it. EVER.
It’s true, I come from a place of priviledge as a white woman, but I still deserve the basic respect I show someone like Tiffany. That basic respect includes not lumping her in with every other women of color simply based on the fact that she IS a women of color.
I’m sorrry but I think I’m worth that.
The privilege inherent in those two situations is quite different.
But really, you’re not being lumped in with all white people, or at least not in the sense you seem to be using it there. White feminists, as a group, have been responsible for a crapload of bad behaviour here; it’s fair if you’ve been on the receiving end of that to be frustrated with that group as a whole. It really is a matter of, if you are not in fact part of the problem, stopping identifying with those people, and realising that they are not, in fact, referring to you specifically.
Put another way - I tend to call out white feminists as a group fairly often. I am also a white feminist. This does not mean I necessarily think that each and every individual white feminist (a group which in which I am part) is a Bad Person.
Ugh. I’m re-reading myself and seeing offensiveness where I didn’t mean it to be. I just think its silly to pretend that because I am white, I don’t identify as a race. It’s not like white is some default non-race.
Rebecca, I hear you. I just think we’ll have to agree to disagree. I’m all for calling out the bullshit– and man is it everywhere– but we need to call it specifically. Not by mass and not based on skin color. That’s just me. I don’t want my skin color to define me and my character any more than anyone else would and I just can’t see Tiffany’s comment any other way.
maybe I’ll get over that eventually…
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I just honestly don’t understand why “you need to get over yourself” is all that terribly offensive, I guess, for one thing. It’s blunt, but it’s not exactly “die in a fire,” you know?
and frankly, well, maybe more of us could stand to get over ourselves a bit more. because, well, it’s -not all about us.-
which i think was kind of the point all along.
also, per the “can’t be trusted,” someone–I think it was Brooklynite again, maybe? –made the analogy of,
you go on the subway, you leave your purse on the seat while you look at the map. Someone tells you, “hey, you shouldn’t do that, people on the subway can’t be trusted.”
which is not necessarily the same thing as saying “no one on this subway is trustworthy, and if you ever have the opportunity to get to know any particular individual in some circumstance that ISN’T the subway, no matter how nice they seem, no matter how long you know them, as soon as you turn your back, THEY’LL STEAL YOUR PURSE.”
depending on who’s speaking, it -might- actually mean that more or less (or never get to know subway riders with one’s guard let down any more than one would have on the subway).
but it also might just mean: look, this is reality as we know it. Maybe most people here aren’t thieves; but chances are still good that -someone- is gonna take your bag if you leave it unguarded. Don’t want your bag taken? Don’t leave it on the seat.
she also made the point, which I thought was kind of brilliant, that actually you know, the REAL problem isn’t even that the place is crawling with thieves, it’s that even if there’s only one thief, if -no one speaks up- when one takes a bag, then -it’s still not safe.- Even if none of the innocent bystanders would ever steal -themselves.- It’s not enough.
On the other hand, if more people -did- call out thieves? Maybe the subway would be a safer place.
amen. that’s what i was trying to say, albeit far less eloquently.
>>It’s not like white is some default non-race.>>
Well, see, no, in fact; that’s exactly what “white” -is.- That’s why the concept ever mattered in the first place. You can not -like- it, but one doesn’t really just opt out of the whole centuries-old constructed System by saying “I don’t agree with that.” Because too much is built on the stuff–90% of which you (general you) never see, because you’re not supposed to–that being “white” is entitled to, that is taken for granted.
This does not mean that you know we can’t all be special little snowflakes each with our own unique Euro-American/regional culture; and in fact it’s worth examining how “white” is defined in the first place (there is for instance a book entitled “How The Irish Became White”).
Unfortunately, it also doesn’t mean that calling oneself Belgian-American, midwestern, Methodist by background, Buddhist by practice, likes cats, sunsets, and Rembrandt, has one ingrown toenail, etc. is really enough to get past the bone-weariness some people have who just don’t really want to deal with anyone else’s snowflakeness right now, because it’s -always- about the snowflakes and it’s never about -them-, and they’re -tired,- and…
and why is it this important? Seriously. To be I don’t know, liked, approved of, not thought of as “racist,” by -anybody.-
and I say all this as someone who generally sympathizes with individualism in a lot of ways, am a child of the Enlightenment, and is enthusiastically in support of an I Blame The Assholes movement.
but at the same time, “hey, -I’m- nice and I’m really trying hard, and I’m upset that this might not be enough for a lot of people”–well, y’know, it just kind of goes with the territory.
And hey, you know what? If ___ really -doesn’t- like or accept you no matter what you do, well, guess what? -You don’t have to like that individual either.- Doesn’t mean no one will. Doesn’t mean there’s some great check-marker in the sky going, “uh oh, this one’s Stained with Original Racism, no good, away to the Fiery Place.” That’s the good part. It doesn’t work like that. It’s just…life.
It’s okay, really.
…because, see, that’s the thing, right? IF you really do believe that it’s all, we should be judged as individuals, then why get that bent out of shape over what one WoC says? Maybe she’s not a representative any more than you are, you know?
Tobes, you’re tiptoeing around the White-Liberal-Bingo card.
As a white woman, I have absolutely zero problem with “white women can’t be trusted” - in the heat of this debacle or at any other time. If you really want to try to draw an analogy, consider an angry, hurt woman saying “Men really can’t be trusted”. That’s a perfectly reasonable thing to say when you’ve been hurt on the basis of your gender over and over and over again by men. Defaulting to “don’t trust” is a sensible, rational protective behaviour.
No white woman is ENTITLED to have women of colour ‘trust’ them. Trust is earned, and it’s not earned easily.
while I’m not holding my breath, I would hope that Jessica Valenti in particular has the spine to join this particular chorus.
Ooh, you’re going to be waiting for a while. Back in 2007 when Amanda was making fun of the people who didn’t like the art, Jessica was right there patting Amanda’s ass.
Lauredhel: Well put. Very well put.
Anneliese: Yeah, I guessed as much. But a girl can hope, right?
See, I think Tiffany’s right.
I’m a trans woman, and after going through days of non-stop anti-trans harassment, I’ve gotten to the point where I can no longer trust cis folk (in the way that belledamme says, not that every cis person is bad, but I don’t know who’s going to turn out to be the one who fucks with me).
So, if it is valid for me on the trans ===> cis direction, why would it be any less valid for me om the WoC ===> white woman direction, regardless of what end of the arrow I’m on (and regardless of whether I get my white back up or not as an emotional reaction)?
And after that thread on Feministe (as well as elsewhere and everywhere, that’s just the most recent stand-out), I gotta say I often feel similarly about able-bodied people. Disablism within feminism is off. the. scale.
Lauredel,
Actually I said that EXACT thing on my blog. I work hard against the urge to say “Men aren’t’ to be trusted.” Because it’s a lazy argument to say: Because many people of this group are mean– all of them are. All men aren’t bad. All white people aren’t the same. Just as I realize that Tiffany isn’t representative of all POC.
I’ve seen the white bingo card and I realize that most people DO consider white the default race. When we describe a person of color, their race is often part of the description. When we describe a white person, it doesn’t come up — it’s default. However, I don’t identify as “default.” I’m white and so is my family and so are many of my friends. We have a history that I am proud of– So yeah, I take it personal.
All that doesn’t mean I don’t benefit from white privilege or that I’m perfect and I understand racism. I’m sure I don’t….
You know, Tiffany did say to me, “You don’t wake up every day inside my black skin and you certainly don’t live my life just like I don’t live yours.” She also said, “I posted how and I feel and that’s my truth.”
Well this is my truth—I think it’s too ‘easy’ to write off all people because many of them have hurt you. It’s just not something I would do and I don’t agree with it.
Easier than what, Tobes? Fighting an uphill battle with every white person you meet to get to a point where maybe they get that their normal actions are damaging to you? Getting hurt time and again when you take the risk?
All that doesn’t mean I don’t benefit from white privilege or that I’m perfect and I understand racism. I’m sure I don’t….
You say that, but you really obviously don’t get it.
I would suggest you stop telling people of colour what they should do.
Yeh, Tobes, the point is, -you- may not do it, “would” do it, whatevs; but what other people do really is not under your control, so maybe best to drop it, hm?
That’s not “your truth” - that’s your interpretation of someone else’s feelings and motivations.
All I’m asking is that someone not dismiss me– a person they’ve never met — based on the fact that I’m white. And imply that because I’m white, I’ll hurt them “time and again” or eventually what?– sell out, step on them to get somewhere? It’s insulting. I’m not trying to deny the many, many bad experiences WOC have had had with white feminists. But I guess I’m arguing this point because saying “white women aren’t to be trusted” sounds a lot like giving up. I still hope and pray that a feminist of color could see me as an ally or at the least not view me as an immediate enemy.
That is my genuine concern. And it IS my truth. I don’t write off men or even conservatives even though I’ve had thousands of reasons too. I try and do the hard work of judging people on a case by case basis, and talking through something when they upset me. At some point you have to walk away from toxic individuals, but does that mean every person from that group is a lost cause?
I’m not trying to tell POC what they feel or how they should feel. I’m saying– THIS IS HOW I FEEL. But what I’m getting in response is ‘better just drop it’ — and I really think that’s counterproductive. I’m not trying to be a thorn in this comment thread but I still think I have a valid point. I keep hearing that we need more dialogue between white feminists and women of color so that we understand each other better. Well I’m trying to understand.
*sigh*
Look– I acknowledge that I’m far from perfect. I AM being defensive here. I have a lot (LOT) to learn and I know I’ve put my foot in my mouth– but I don’t want people writing me off based on my skin color. I don’t think anyone wants that.
I’m not disputing white privilege, that racism exists, that I couldn’t possibly understand the unique challenges women of color face… but I’d like to try, I’m not saying it’s anyone’s job to teach me. I’m just saying if someone calls me out, I’ll listen to the criticism and try and benefit.
Everyone keeps trying to explain to me WHY it’s okay that Tiffany said what she said or why it shouldn’t bother me or why it’s true, but I just can’t understand. Some have even said, “It’s not necessarily all white people,” but her exact words were “ya’ll” as in YOU ALL. As in white people = untrustworthy. I just can’t ever be okay with that.
Belledame, you are right when you say I can’t control what other people think or do. But I’m just voicing my opinion on all of this. And I think I have that right just as much as anyone else.
Honestly, I feel like we’re arguing a tiny point here. As far as the Marcotte/book/BFP situation, I’m in agreement. It’s just that one ‘can’t-be-trusted’ statement and (continued support of said statement) that’s bothering me.
I think Lauredhel and belledame effectively responded to much of the above, and I’m not happy about further derailing the point of this post, but it’s just, Tobes - I honestly don’t get (even though it’s kind of a privileged-class thang) why you’re taking this on such a weirdly personal level.
“I still hope and pray that a feminist of color could see me as an ally or at the least not view me as an immediate enemy.”
Where on earth did that come from? I certainly hope that a good few women of colour see me as an ally, but it’s my job to walk the walk and earn that respect through my actions, not through passive-aggressive, entitled “but I’m one of the good ones!” tantrums. Where does a member of an oppressed minority group distrusting those who as a group have oppressed hir turn into always and forever viewing each and every individual member of that group as “an immediate enemy”?
Tobes, you’ve just demonstrated that, regardless of what other white people do YOU are not to be trusted because you just engaged in the silencing, redirective, entitled behaviour that poc hate, but get all the time. Seriously, a person can’t distrust white people without you chucking a tantrum about it? Your “allyhood” is not worth the trouble.
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I am so, so, so, SOOOOOOOO stressed right now. I am not trying to silence anyone. ANYWHERE. This is a comment that was posted on MY blog about how “white girls need to get over themselves” and aren’t to be trusted. As a white feminist blogger that really scared me and I continue to try and ask why that’s an okay thing to say—Why (without knowing anything else about me except that I am white) would I be considered untrustworthy?
I never meant for this to go anywhere bad and I’m sorry if I gave someone the idea that by engaging in debate, I am silencing them. All I’ve ever tried to do is understand because hearing that there’s this untrustworthiness about white women or white feminists SCARES ME.
I’m seeing now I should just shut my mouth and quit questioning, because if I continue to do so, I further put myself into enemy camp and am accused of throwing tantrums.
I can honestly say I’ve never felt so misunderstood in the blogosphere before today. I’ll continue examining issues of racism and privilege at my blog and in my personal life. Maybe someday I’ll feel differently about Tiffany’s original statment, maybe I’ll see it differently. But maybe not. And that’s okay too.
Please believe my sincerity when I say that I’m truly sorry I am no longer welcome here. It wasn’t supposed to go this way.
>>hearing that there’s this untrustworthiness about white women or white feminists SCARES ME.>>
I honestly don’t get this either, but I suppose we’re past the point of trying to understand why at this point…
Tobes, look at *where* that statement is actually coming from. Look at the position this person is in. It’s not a personal attack. It’s talking about how ingrained and institutionalized racism is - even within progressive movements that are supposed to be *above* that shit, but, as we keep discovering, are not.